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jsnКак же все-таки Бодрийяр рулит.
By the way, do you know how General Schwarzkopf, the great Gulf War strategist, celebrated his victory? He had a huge party at Disney World. These festivities in the palace of the imaginary were a worthy conclusion to such a virtual war.
...
Similarly, it is useless to keep searching for computer viruses since we are all caught in a viral chain of networks anyway. Information itself has become viral; perhaps not sexually transmissible yet, but much more powerful through its numerical propagation.
(Disneyworld Company. Все-таки они здорово похожи с Эко. Эко пытается придерживаться позиций семиологии, а Бодрийяр -- философии, но результат получается очень сходный).
к старой теме "реализм vs номинализм", о схлопывании онтологического знания и моральном релятивизме:
The belief in truth is part of the elementary forms of religious life. It is a weakness of understanding, of common-sense. At the same time, it is the last stronghold for the supporters of morality, for the apostles of the legality of the real and the rational, according to whom the reality principle cannot be questioned. Fortunately, nobody, not even those who teach it, lives according to this principle, and for a good reason: nobody really believes in the real. Nor do they believe in the evidence of real life. This
would be too sad.
(Radical Thought)
кто-нибудь, пожалуйста, дайте почитать "Simulacra & Simulation" на английском или русском, или подскажите, где в Москве можно купить?
By the way, do you know how General Schwarzkopf, the great Gulf War strategist, celebrated his victory? He had a huge party at Disney World. These festivities in the palace of the imaginary were a worthy conclusion to such a virtual war.
...
Similarly, it is useless to keep searching for computer viruses since we are all caught in a viral chain of networks anyway. Information itself has become viral; perhaps not sexually transmissible yet, but much more powerful through its numerical propagation.
(Disneyworld Company. Все-таки они здорово похожи с Эко. Эко пытается придерживаться позиций семиологии, а Бодрийяр -- философии, но результат получается очень сходный).
к старой теме "реализм vs номинализм", о схлопывании онтологического знания и моральном релятивизме:
The belief in truth is part of the elementary forms of religious life. It is a weakness of understanding, of common-sense. At the same time, it is the last stronghold for the supporters of morality, for the apostles of the legality of the real and the rational, according to whom the reality principle cannot be questioned. Fortunately, nobody, not even those who teach it, lives according to this principle, and for a good reason: nobody really believes in the real. Nor do they believe in the evidence of real life. This
would be too sad.
(Radical Thought)
кто-нибудь, пожалуйста, дайте почитать "Simulacra & Simulation" на английском или русском, или подскажите, где в Москве можно купить?
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no subject
Date: 2001-12-17 11:51 am (UTC)Î÷åíü äàæå ïðîñòàÿ - â ïðåäïîëîæåíèè ÷òî ó ðûíêà òðóäà ìîãóò áûòü æåðòâû.
Èìåëîñü â âèäó, ÷òî âòîðàÿ ïîòåðÿ ðàáîòû ìåòàëëóðãàìè êàê áû íå íàñòîÿùàÿ, ïîýòîìó ïåðâàÿ ïîòåðÿ ðàáîòû ïîìå÷åíà ñëîâîì "real".
×òî-òî ìíå êàæåòñÿ ÷òî Âû ïîäèãðûâàåòå Áîäðèÿðó. Àâòîð ñêàçàë òîëüêî ÷òî óâîëåííûå è åñòü real victims of job market.
Ïîíÿòíî, ÷òî human genome ïðèâîäèòñÿ êàê ïðèìåð "ðåàëüíîé âåùè", êîòîðàÿ ìîæåò áûòü àññèìèëèðîâàíà äèñíååâñêèì ìåõàíèçìîì ñèìóëÿöèé as is, äëÿ ýòîãî äîñòàòî÷íî çíàòü ïðèìåðíóþ ôîðìó âåùè, íå áîëåå òîãî.
Êàê Âû, íàâåðíîå, çàìåòèëè, ÿ íå ïèòàþ îñîáîãî ïî÷òåíèÿ ã ã-íó Áîäðèéÿðó, îò÷åãî ñêëîíåí ïîëàãàòü ÷òî ïàññàæ ïðî ãåíîì íàïèñàí ïðîñòî äëÿ êðàñíîãî ñëîâöà. ß òàê æå äîëæåí ïðèçíàòüñÿ ÷òî íå âïîëíå ïîíèìàþ ÷òî òàêîå ñèìóëÿöèÿ âîîáùå è "ñèìóëÿöèÿ ãåíîìà" : àòòðàêöèîí, äåìîíñòðèðóþùèé ðàáîòó ðèáîñîìû äëÿ êàêîãî-òî SciencePark'à? Èñïîëüçîâàíèå äâîéíîé ñïèðàëè êàê ñèìâîëà íàó÷íîãî çíàíèÿ?
Êñòàòè, øêîëüíûé ó÷åáíèê ëþáîãî ïðåäìåòà åñòü, åñëè óãîäíî, ñèìóëÿöèÿ çíàíèÿ; îò÷åãî íà ïåðâîì êóðñå è îãîðîøèâàþò ñîîáùåíèåì "çàáóäüòå âñå ÷åìó âàñ ó÷èëè â øêîëå". Òàê áûëî âñåãäà è ïîëàãàþ ÷òî òàê æå îñòàíåòñÿ íàâñåãäà.
íî îñíîâíàÿ ìûñëü - ÷òî ïðîáëåìà èíôîðìàöèîííûõ âèðóñîâ êîðåíèòñÿ íå â ñåòè êàê òàêîâîé, à â òîì, ÷òî ê ýòîé ñåòè ïîäêëþ÷åíî
Âû îïÿòü, ÈÌÕÎ, ïîäèãðûâàåòå Áîäðèÿðó, âû÷èòàâàÿ èç åãî ïóòàíûõ ïðåäëîæåíèé íåêèé ñìûñë. Áîäðèÿð ãîâîðèò î òîì, ÷òî, ïîñêîëüêó èíôîðìàöèÿ, äåñêàòö, âèðàëüíà, òî íèêàêîé ðàçíèöû ìåæäó âèðóñîì è îáû÷íîé ïðîãðàììîé âñå ðàâíî íåò.
Äîìîõîçÿéêà, ïðîâîäÿùàÿ áîëüøóþ ÷àñòü ñâîåãî âðåìåíè â ïîãëîùåíèè ìûëüíûõ îïåð, î÷åâèäíî, óäåëÿåò î÷åíü ìíîãî âíèìàíèÿ ñèìóëÿöèè ïðîñòîé ðåàëüíîé æèçíè.
Åñëè áû, çà îòñóòñâèåì òåëåâèçîðà/êèíî, îíà ïîãëîùàëà áû êîììåð÷åñêèå ðîìàíû, â ÷åì áûëà áû ðàçíèöà?
no subject
Date: 2001-12-17 12:41 pm (UTC)Íå âèæó ñâÿçè. Îáîðîò äîñòàòî÷íî íåéòðàëüíûé, è òåêñò â îáùåì îòíþäü íå êðèòèêóåò ðûíîê òðóäà.
×òî-òî ìíå êàæåòñÿ ÷òî Âû ïîäèãðûâàåòå Áîäðèÿðó. Àâòîð ñêàçàë òîëüêî ÷òî óâîëåííûå è åñòü
real victims of job market.
 òåêñòå ÷åòêî ïðîòèâîïîñòàâëåíî ïåðâîå è âòîðîå óâîëüíåíèå, è "real victims of job market" ñîâåðøåííî ÿâíî îòíîñèòñÿ òîëüêî ê ïåðâîìó, íó, íà ìîé âçãëÿä.
Áåçóñëîâíî, ÿ ñêîðåå ñêëîíåí ïîäûãðûâàòü ïðàêòè÷åñêè ëþáîìó òåêñòó, íåæåëè óäàðÿòüñÿ â ïðîòèâîïîëîæíóþ êðàéíîñòü. È, ðàçóìååòñÿ, ÿ ñòàðàþñü ðàçãëÿäåòü ñìûñë è âûíóæäåí ìåñòàìè ãèïîñòàçèðîâàòü ñìûñëû è äîñòðàèâàòü íåâûñêàçàííûå âåùè. Ïî-ìîåìó, ýòî ñîâåðøåííî íîðìàëüíî ïðè ÷òåíèè ýññå.
Êàê Âû, íàâåðíîå, çàìåòèëè, ÿ íå ïèòàþ îñîáîãî ïî÷òåíèÿ ã ã-íó Áîäðèéÿðó, îò÷åãî ñêëîíåí ïîëàãàòü ÷òî ïàññàæ ïðî ãåíîì íàïèñàí ïðîñòî äëÿ êðàñíîãî ñëîâöà.
Êðàñíîòà ñëîâöà, â îáùåì ñëó÷àå, íå èñêëþ÷àåò îñìûñëåííîñòè âûñêàçûâàíèÿ; êðîìå òîãî, îïÿòü æå, èñïîëüçîâàíèå êðàñíîãî ñëîâöà â ýññå êàê ìèíèìóì äîïóñòèìî, ÷òîáû íå ñêàçàòü "æåëàòåëüíî". ×òî äî êîíêðåòíîãî èñïîëüçîâàíèÿ ãåíîìà â ñèìóëÿöèè -- íå çíàþ, ñêàæåì, âûñòàâî÷íîå çäàíèå â ôîðìå ìîëåêóëû ÄÍÊ (êàê ñèìâîë èñêóññòâà èìèòàöèè) âïîëíå ñîéäåò. Íå ñóòü.
íî îñíîâíàÿ ìûñëü - ÷òî ïðîáëåìà èíôîðìàöèîííûõ âèðóñîâ êîðåíèòñÿ íå â ñåòè êàê òàêîâîé, à â òîì, ÷òî ê ýòîé ñåòè ïîäêëþ÷åíî
Âû îïÿòü, ÈÌÕÎ, ïîäèãðûâàåòå Áîäðèÿðó, âû÷èòàâàÿ èç åãî ïóòàíûõ ïðåäëîæåíèé íåêèé ñìûñë.
Ýòîò ïàññàæ Âû, âåðîÿòíî, çàõîòèòå ïåðåàäðåñîâàòü
Áîäðèéÿð, çàìåòèì â ñêîáêàõ, íå îòðèöàåò ðàçíèöû ìåæäó âèðóñîì è ïðîãðàììîé, à ëèøü óêàçûâàåò íà ñõîäñòâî ìåæäó âèðóñîì è èíôîðìàöèåé (ïîäûãðûâàÿ åìó, ÿ ñêàæó, ÷òî çà ñëîâîì "èíôîðìàöèÿ" ÿ çäåñü âèæó ñëîâî "ìèôîëîãåìà").
Åñëè áû, çà îòñóòñâèåì òåëåâèçîðà/êèíî, îíà ïîãëîùàëà áû êîììåð÷åñêèå ðîìàíû, â ÷åì áûëà áû ðàçíèöà?
ðîìàí -- æàíð ïðèíöèïèàëüíî ìåíåå èìèòàòèâíûé. ðàçíèöà, î÷åâèäíî, áûëà áû êîëè÷åñòâåííàÿ.
no subject
Date: 2001-12-17 12:55 pm (UTC)Ìîæíî óçíàòü ïðè÷èíó? ß íå ÷èòàë åãî ñåðüåçíûõ òåêñòîâ, íî åãî ýññå ìíå î÷åíü äàæå íðàâÿòñÿ.